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Pain-Killing Without Pharmaceuticals Using Powerful Wearable Red Light Therapy: The Kineon Move+ Approach With Forrest Smith


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Explore the dynamic intersection of tech entrepreneurship and wellness innovation with today’s remarkable guest, Forrest Smith, and discover a little-known way to kill pain and heal up joints fast, without drugs or expensive physical therapy modalities. 

As the visionary founder of Kineon Labs, a former extreme athlete, and an esteemed leader, Forrest brings to the forefront an impressive 20-year track record of not only creating but also scaling successful startups.

An avid sports enthusiast, Forrest’s competitive spirit was honed on the fields of Atlanta, where he played various sports and continues to actively participate in rugby matches and CrossFit training. This athletic passion was the catalyst for the conception of the Kineon MOVE+ enhanced light therapy device, a key offering from Reviiv Light that embodies his commitment to health and fitness.

From the age of 14, Forrest has cultivated a deep fascination for Chinese culture and language, a passion that has grown into fluency and profound professional expertise in the Asian market. His 18 years of experience in startup creation and executive management in Asia have been marked by considerable success.

In 2000, Forrest embarked on his first entrepreneurial journey in China with a fabric-sourcing company, which was later acquired in 2002. Over the next decade, he demonstrated his exceptional aptitude for business development and leadership, founding and directing a series of companies, including Source Pro Asia, August Vale, and Illumitron. Each venture flourished under his guidance, leading to acquisition by larger corporations, such as Wilway Holdings and Cooper Lighting.

In addition to his remarkable entrepreneurial journey, Forrest has demonstrated his versatility and expertise through various roles, from Director of Asian Operations for a Fortune 500 company to Director of Business Development. His educational background is as diverse and robust as his professional experience, with an International Baccalaureate focused on Chinese, further studies at the prestigious Nanjing University/Johns Hopkins Center, and undergraduate studies at Georgia Tech.

His profound dedication to his work, coupled with his extensive experience and knowledge, positions Forrest as a thought leader in his industry, driving the integration of health, wellness, and advanced technology.

During our discussion, you’ll discover:

– Forrest’s background in fitness and transition into technology…6:12

Former extreme athlete, rugby player, and CrossFitter
Delved into studying technology in China
Paved the way for photobiomodulation

Lived in China for almost 20 years
Relocated his family to Mexico during the COVID-19 pandemic
Left China just before lockdown
Didn’t intend to stay in Mexico

-Benefits of living in Mexico…10:33

Lives in San Miguel de Allende
Great quality of schools for his boys
Most places are above 7000 ft altitude
Great location for altitude training

Ease of doing business in Mexico
Overall growth as a business hub
Strengthening currency

Evolving global landscape
Promising future for Mexico

Trainer bikes in Forrest’s home:

-How Forrest initially became interested in red light therapy…16:12

Playing rugby in South China reignited his passion for contact sports
Had been involved in gym lifting
Lacked metabolic conditioning

High-stress work life in entrepreneurial pursuits
Seven-day workweek
Used metabolic training as a stress relief strategy

Metabolic training became vital for offsetting age-related injuries and harnessing cognitive benefits
Observed in both scientific literature and daily personal experiences
Forrest uses metabolic training for overall well-being

The impact of inflammation from injuries and overuse
Exercise can trigger inflammation in old injuries
Can impede cardiovascular functions and affect overall health
Injuries on endothelial tissue
Stiffening of blood vessel walls
Decreased cardiovascular strength
Potential for severe events or mortality

Red light therapy and its beneficial effects on inflammation
Inflammation management in old injuries
Forrest was initially skeptical about its efficacy
Dispelled after delving into the medical literature

Calroy (20% discount auto-applied at checkout)
Podcast with Dr. Jack Wolfson:

Developed Kineon Health — targeted red light therapy (use code BGLIFE to save 10%)
Triggers specific photo acceptors within the body
Uses different wavelengths and powers
Optimal light distribution through tissue

-Forrest’s red light therapy discoveries for health optimization…28:15

The Kineon team focused extensively on modeling light distribution (use code BGLIFE to save 10%)
Started with the intended results and worked backward
Identified the depth of photo acceptors in tissue
Modeled how light and photons optimally activate targeted signaling molecules within the body
Beer-Lambert law for understanding photon distribution through tissue

Other companies focus on engineering dose measurements or metrics
Upgraded internal models using existing ones
Able to pinpoint photo acceptor locations and reservoirs within tissue depths

Avoided building abstract mathematical models detached from reality
Leveraged devices like NNOXX for serum nitric oxide measurement
Evan Peikon, co-founder of NNOXX
Baselining and verification of expected outcomes

Able to verify model accuracy by comparing expected physiological responses to actual measurements

Kineon’s optimized dosing model and treatment methods
Differences between surface and internal tissue treatment
Differences between LED and laser use
Direct and broad emission patterns of lasers and LEDs

Kineon’s approach to photobiomodulation
Precise dosing for effective outcomes

-Photo acceptors and how they interact with light…31:16

Molecules within tissues targeted by light energy for downstream signaling
Increased energy production
Positively affects cellular functions
Reduces oxidative stress
Benefits cardiovascular tissue through nitric oxide release

Discoveries indicate that distributing the same power across multiple emitters can be more effective than concentrating it through a single source
Overdosing with light doesn’t cause damage but diminishes therapeutic benefits
Could lead to an overflow of free radical production, excessive nitric oxide, and ATP production
The most powerful lasers might not necessarily yield the best results
Communication with molecular-level photo acceptors in the body is crucial

VCSEL lasers
Removing bottlenecks in the electron transport chain with compounds like methylene blue
Enhanced energy production

Spirulina and chlorella
Bioblue (use code BEN to save 10%)

-Proper dosing of Kineon’s Red Light Therapy devices and the effects…38:32

For photobiomodulation, the key is the dosing
Uses both Class 1 and Class 2 lasers in the devices
Class 2 lasers found to be more effective
How the light is distributed affects dosing

Arndt-Schulz curve
Lasers emit light in a very direct manner (called a collimated beam)
LEDs emit light in a Lambertian pattern — 360 degrees
Kineon article: “Red Light Therapy vs. Near Infrared vs. Infrared: Key Differences Explained”
Powerful lasers might not necessarily yield the best results
Communication with molecular-level photo acceptors in the body is crucial

Recommended treatment time:
15 minutes, twice a day for serious tissue damage, acute inflammation, or long-term tissue damage

Helps in growing healthier soft tissues
Increases chondroblast proliferation and type two cartilage in response to inflammation

Kineon (use code BGLIFE to save 10%)

-Red light therapy compared to cold therapy…46:17

Cold therapy might not be as effective as perceived, especially post-injury or inflammation
The RICE method (rest, ice, compression, elevation) may not be good advice
Kineon’s article: “Icing vs. Red Light Therapy: The Ultimate Guide”

Clinical trial-based evidence for the efficacy of light therapy over cryogenic treatment
Cold therapy’s potential neurological impacts might not directly aid in injury recovery or hypertrophy: “The effects of cold water immersion and active recovery on inflammation and cell stress responses in human skeletal muscle after resistance exercise”
Cold therapy benefits
Glycemic variability
Conversion of white fat to brown fat
Reduced inflammatory markers

Dosing and variabilities in results
Shorter, milder exposures to cold may be favorable to prolonged, extreme cold exposures

-Kineon’s products in development that involve transcranial/intranasal photobiomodulation…55:17

Brain modules and correlating dosing models
Biomarkers such as heart rate and HRV
Measuring behavior of neurological tissue from a metabolic standpoint

High correlation between metabolic dysfunction and psychological disorders
Bipolar disorder

Kineon uses photobiomodulation (PBM) — a non-invasive medical treatment that utilizes low-level light to stimulate cellular activity and promote healing — with neurofeedback to create more impactful devices
Potential therapy and treatment for conditions like:
Major depressive disorder
Chronic anxiety

Optimizing devices to enhance outcomes and quality of life
Vielight (use code GREENFIELD to save 10%)
Neuronic (use code BENG100 to save $100)
WAVi device
Electrical sensors for brain activity and machine learning for data interpretation
Compares data collection between electrical sensors and new laser/sensor technologies

Emerging tools, like silicon photomultipliers for higher-resolution machine learning
More extensive machine learning applications than electrical sensors

-Good alternative to NSAIDs are Kineon therapy devices…1:03:55

Negative effects of NSAIDs on health
Kineon’s article: “NSAIDS vs. Red Light Therapy”
Tissue recovery, inflammation reduction, and pain relief
Daily Kineon use for:
Tissue remodeling
Inflammation reduction
Pain relief
Best when used on bare skin
Blanching effect to improve wavelength penetration

Reduction in muscle inflammatory markers among athletes for recovery
Decrease in C-reactive proteins and creatinine kinase levels

Cost-effective design
Accessible for home use

-And much more…

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Click here for the full written transcript of this podcast episode.

Resources from this episode:

Forrest Smith:

Kineon (use code BGLIFE to save 10%)

– Podcast:

– Other Resources:

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Do you have questions, thoughts, or feedback for Forrest Smith or me? Leave your comments below and one of us will reply!

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